Do you think the US military should eliminate the physical fitness double standard for women?
scotty7617 asked:
One of the requirements for being in the US military is that every once in a while, you have to pass a physical fitness test. The standards on these tests are lower for women than they are for men.
In the army a male soldier, age 17-21, has two minutes to do a minimum of 42 pushups. A female age 17-21 must do 19. A male soldier age 17-21 must be able to run two miles in 15:54. A female, age 17-21 must do it in 18:54. Sit-ups are equal.
I knew strong female soldiers who could pass the test by the male standards, but there were also many who could only pass because of the double standard. It should all be equal.
Before you ask How is it relevant?, I’ll say it’s VERY relevant. Anyone eho has served in the military can tell you, that regardless of your job, you do a lot of heavy lifting.
Also, these double standards do not exist in combat, and if you are not strong enough to do 25 pushups, you are NOT going to be strong enough to pick up a 230 lb soldier and carry them to safety.
Actually, minga, yes I do think the age double standard should be eliminated as well.
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One of the requirements for being in the US military is that every once in a while, you have to pass a physical fitness test. The standards on these tests are lower for women than they are for men.
In the army a male soldier, age 17-21, has two minutes to do a minimum of 42 pushups. A female age 17-21 must do 19. A male soldier age 17-21 must be able to run two miles in 15:54. A female, age 17-21 must do it in 18:54. Sit-ups are equal.
I knew strong female soldiers who could pass the test by the male standards, but there were also many who could only pass because of the double standard. It should all be equal.
Before you ask How is it relevant?, I’ll say it’s VERY relevant. Anyone eho has served in the military can tell you, that regardless of your job, you do a lot of heavy lifting.
Also, these double standards do not exist in combat, and if you are not strong enough to do 25 pushups, you are NOT going to be strong enough to pick up a 230 lb soldier and carry them to safety.
Actually, minga, yes I do think the age double standard should be eliminated as well.
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yes..I hate pushups and women only have to do a modified pushup..pisses me off
Women get paid the same, and receive the same benefits as Men. The workload and Requirements should be the same! If their requirements are 1/3 then their pay should be 1/3.
I hate seeing women get out of deployments because they get knocked-up. That’s dereliction of duty if you ask me!
Now, if she has been trying to have a child for several months before the deployment notice, then I don’t have a problem with her.
Regardless of the actual requirements….. we need to start enforcing failures.
For example, why do we continue to let fat, out of shape soldiers who have not passed a PT test since basic training continue to serve.
Not sure. How do you feel about the age ‘double standard’? The amount you are expected to do lowers as you age as well. Should they eliminate that as well?
The reason for this is because physically, men and women ARE NOT equal. There are exceptions to the rule (i.e. some women who can do what guys can and some guys who can’t even do what guys can) but that is why the lower standard exists.
That is also another reason that women can’t be in combat units. That doesn’t mean they’ll never be in a combat situation (because even the support units can see action) but they can’t sign up to be in the Infantry or the Cavalry for example.
The female center of gravity is different than men. It is harder for a female to do a push up because of the center of gravity not strength. For the same reason it is eaiser for a female to do situps than a man. I feel a woman could and would carry a fellow soldier to safety or die trying just as a male soldier would.
Who cares?!?!?! We need people in the military! And if it takes having a double standard to get our women to fight and serve then so be it. Honestly, most women are weaker than men. Women’s bodies are not built like men. Men’s bodies are built to be muscular and physical. Women’s are built to birth babies. I’m not a feminist but this question really irks me. You should be grateful women want to be in the military! As for this if you are not strong enough to do 25 pushups, you are NOT going to be strong enough to pick up a 230 lb soldier and carry them to safety bullsh*t……you don’t know what a human body can do in the event of an emergency. Hence when regular people lift cars and such to save people. When you see a woman who is in the military you should thank her for having the balls for even doing something only men are seen able to do!
Perhaps they should modify it some, I think most women in decent shape can do more then 19 push ups in 2 minutes, but if they have to be equal very few women would be in the military. Plus I have a female cousin in the Air Force who has a complete desk job. I doubt she does very much heavy lifting. My husband is in the Army Guard and they have quite a few guys who haven’t passed a PT test in years, but they are still in. He has been in for 10 years and there have been times he hasn’t passed. In fact when he got his E-5 he failed his PT test while at Sergeant school. He had to pass it with in a few months once he got home, but he still got his E-5 before he passed. So I personally feel more emphasis needs to be put on PT, especially in the guard.
No because you have women who are as strong if not stronger, than some man. But that’s very rare. You can’t expect for a small
woman to pick up a heavy man no matter how many push ups or how fast she can run. It’s not
going to happen.Most women are not that good
doing pushups because it’s associated with males.
Age double standard? Hardly.
Check the APFT charts. Take a look at the push-ups alone. You’ll find that the number of repetitions you have to do to achieve 100 actually RISES to where someone in the 17-21 age group only has to crank out 71 reps, while someone in the 27-31 age group has to crank out 77! That’s hardly a double standard favoring older Soldiers, especially as this stays higher than the 17-21 age group til you hit 37-41, where most everyone is hitting their 20 year mark for retirement.
As for heavy lifting, I could point to a good number of people (i.e. S-1 and S-2 shops) where the physical workload is NOT substantial. A graduated scale for age does make sense - anyone who claims that age is a basis for discrimination is out of their mind. Yep, I’m really sure I want that Quartermaster Guru with 22 years in to be called a shambag because he falls into the 42-46 age group and his push-up max is only 66. Not a chance.
The only things that do not make sense are the weigh and tape standards, because they allow extremely fit people to be termed fat because of their body dimensions, and allowing women to crank out much less physical effort and yet calling the standards equal on terms of gender.
As for the combat scenario, situations of extreme duress are NOT the yardstick by which physical fitness should be measured. Someone who is 150lbs and can hit 300 on their PT test on the male charts is going to have a hell of a time with that 230lb Soldier on the example who has 100+lbs of gear on him to boot. Adrenaline can do wonderful things, but it’s not a reliable indicator of physical fitness.
It appears that you do not understand the purpose of the APFT. The purpose of the test is simply to ensure that all soldiers are in good physical condition.
Since age and sex do affect the performance of specific muscle groups making everybody meet the same standards would mean that we can have a 20 year old male who is out of shape pass the test while a 45 year old female in excellent shape will fail it.
Thus the scale has been modified to account for these differences.
I think they should have the same requirements. I think to get in they should be different becuase women do not do the same physical work and work outs as men outside of the military. I think the military should have a training program that would bring women up to the standard to pass equal PT standards. That point made I think that the PT test is stupid because it does not show who is best able to do each job. Situps and push ups have nothing to do with any job in the military. I made more sense when you did runs in combat boots and distances with rucksacks. A man or woman might not be able to pass a PT test, but they could do all the physical requirements of carrying shells, assembling, and loading a piece of artillery. Not every man can, not every woman can.
I also think that the weight standards for both genders are a bizarre thing to worry about. If you can physically and mentally do your job, I’d rather have you on my team than someone who looks good in their DA photo but can’t tell a headlight from a BA1100N and couldn’t recon his way out of paper bag.